585.427.9848 – Stoney’s Plaza, 2852 West Henrietta Road, Henrietta, NY 14623-2020
Eric Kunsman’s photographs of “dated” technology – on view at Buffalo, New York’s CEPA Gallery through June 5th, convey an important public utility and its implications in the age of smartphone ubiquity.
Who uses payphones?
That was my first question when looking at Eric Kunsman’s series Felicific Calculus. Since relocating his studio from a well-heeled Rochester, NY neighborhood to one described by concerned colleagues as “a war zone” in 2017, the artist and educator has photographed public phones throughout the city in an attempt to answer that critical question.
Kunsman’s black and white compositions elegantly convey neighborhoods throughout Rochester, centering the public utility even when the phones are not at the center of the images. Some hold space in the middle and background planes, requiring us to look closely at their surroundings. As Kunsman explained in our 2020 PhotoNOLA portfolio review, payphones serve crucial social needs; connecting job seekers with potential employers, communicating with distant loved ones, and as COVID-19 blazed across the country, calling emergency services.
Kunsman’s immersive ongoing documentary project goes well beyond a time-limited installation by providing audiences with overlapping statistics including payphone use, economic status, ethnicity, age, gender, race, and crime. Read on to learn more about this important project, and if you can’t make it to Buffalo for the closing, follow this link to see a VR tour.
Roula Seikaly in conversation with Eric Kunsman
585.232.9384 – ABC School of Driving, 557 State Street, Rochester, NY 14608 © Eric Kunsman
Roula Seikaly: Why photograph payphones?
Eric Kunsman: My studio was by the Eastman Museum for 10 years. And then I relocated my studio to the other part of Rochester, where the baseball stadium, soccer stadium are. It's really not a good term to be used here in Rochester, but it's humbly known as the Crescent. It was started by a Criminal Justice professor at RIT, but we don't use that term anymore. The police are using it all the time, it really mislabels the people in that area.
As I was moving my studio, three kids - Harry, Elijah and Grumpy - asked "can we help you, mister?" I'm like, "Yeah," and I knew I couldn’t pay them. They're like "Well, what do you have on your coffee mugs?" I'm like, "Grumpy, you can't have one until you tell me your name." He goes, "It's Grumpy. I've been grumpy since I was 1-year-old when my mother took a lollipop from me."
We used to see the classic movies where somebody moves into a neighborhood and everybody comes over to say hello. You don't get that in suburban America anymore. But, it happened with those boys when I moved my studio. It's just there's more of a community there. It’s more diversified. When people label that area as a war zone, it pisses me off. So, as I looked at my neighborhood, I settled on photographing the payphones as a signal of community.
585.254.9782– Family Dollar Store #1962, 1340 Lyell Avenue, Rochester, NY -2020, 2021 © Eric Kunsman
Seikaly: That took me off-guard when we talked about it at PhotoNOLA. It would never occur to me to think about payphones as an indicator of crime activity or a signal of “danger” in a given neighborhood. Did it surprise you as well to hear that?
Kunsman: Well, I think they were just listing off a few things to me. A realtor commented on it, too. What was weird is I had already noticed the payphones. Because it was a side comment, I kinda dismissed it, but then later on, I tried to figure out why people were labeling it. If I wasn't living in the suburbs and pissed off about what a lot of my colleagues and friends were saying, I probably would have never have thought about the phones. It was a knee-jerk reaction. If people weren't labeling it and mislabeling these people, I would've never started this project.
585.334.9837 – The Pizza Corner, 5665 West Henrietta Road, West Henrietta, NY 14586. © Eric Kunsman
Seikaly: Yeah. It sounds like it opened up a new mental and creative space for you, and fueled ongoing social justice engagement efforts.
Kunsman: Yeah, it’s such a different experience for kids who live there. With Covid and quarantine, the biggest concern was the kids getting food. 5% of the Rochester school district students are below the poverty threshold. It's not a joke, but when I first started the project, it was just driving around looking for them, looking for social markers, and then when I started seeing that the phones are still being utilized. I was like, wait a minute, who's still using a payphone? That's when I knew I needed to research and learn more.
585.325.9301 – Genesee Brewery, 445 Saint Paul Street, Building #6, Rochester, NY 14605 © Eric Kunsman
Household Income Census Data 2019 for Monroe County, NY
Seikaly: Would you say this is an ongoing project? You started in 2017, and it's now 2021. Do you want to continue photographing throughout Rochester or the state of New York?
Kunsman: Whenever I travel for my other exhibition, I photograph, but more of a support element to say, "Hey, look, Rochester's not the only one." I've only captured 743 of the 1455 payphones. It's become... I'll just say an addiction to really try to capture all of them because what I'm learning about the environments of each space around the phones. It’s an environmental portrait of where the payphone's sitting. I feel if I don't capture all those environments, have I really finished the study?
The biggest thing for me is I don't wanna be exploiting Rochester and the poor in Rochester. I want to look at each area's social markers - remnants of payphones that don’t work in Buffalo, or unpaved roads in Denver. We invited the Buffalo community to go out and photograph their payphones. They're submitting them to me, and as they're submitting them, they're gonna give their cross streets and address. We're gonna map those.
Fuji's jumped on board, they're donating three digital cameras once we figure out how to do it. I'm giving printing services and some prints, but it's really gonna be a study about Buffalo, so we relate it back to, "Why did this payphone show up 50 times, this one once or twice?" We already have 120 submissions.
585.427.9821 – Pizza Hut #606105, 3120 Winton Road South, Rochester, NY 14623 © Eric Kunsman
Seikaly: The corporate support means everything. You referenced Frontier Communications in the project statement. That's the telephone provider in Rochester? Did you approach them?
Kunsman: I'm not somebody that just reaches out to the people... I don't have that skill, let's put it that way. So, a friend of mine who was like, "You know what? I'm gonna do this for you." He wound his way through their corporate communication phone tree, finally got through to marketing and communications, explained what I was doing. And somebody there was like, "You know what, I really like what's going on here," and all we asked for was a list of all the payphones.
They got back to us about three months later. Once I had that initial connection, then I was able to follow-up with what I was doing. They provided the list as their sponsorship for it, and sadly, everybody that worked with me at that time left within four months.
585.964.9801 – Hamlin Beach State Park, 4 Hamlin Beach Road, Hamlin, NY 14464 © Eric Kunsman
Seikaly: That leads into my next question. If the payphone is damaged, does Frontier repair it, or allow it to fall out of service?
Kunsman: I would have thought, no, but I've seen it first hand that they fix the phones. Apparently, there's a disconnect within their corporation of whoever is in marketing and communications which, if they would only realize they are still doing something for the greater good of the community. There's no way they're making money off this. In fact, they've been in bankruptcy since March. If Frontier Communication disappears, who's gonna sustain these? And that's a big part of my message: will the city take them over or whoever buys them out? I've realized I can't just allow that answer to play out because of politics.
There's a not-for-profit out of Portland, Oregon called Futel, and they're installing free payphones using voiceover IP in Portland. Technology is moving so fast and magnifies income disparity in this country. In the neighborhood where my studio is, the average family income is $25,000 a year, that's average, so there are people that are below and above that. I've been recording the audio stories for that reason.
That's where in CEPA Gallery, I have payphones with a Raspberry Pie mini-computer with audio recordings inside of them, so you hear their stories played back, but that same technology is what Futel is using. In fact the gentleman from Futel helped me to hack those phones, so I can put them in the gallery, but I wanna bring that service here to Rochester. I wanna put one in Susan B. Anthony’s neighborhood or Frederick Douglass’s, to share those important history lessons. So when COVID's over, people will pick it up and hear whether it's a reenactor or just somebody reading an audio history lesson about Frederick Douglass or Susan B Anthony.
Seikaly: It's such a graceful way of realizing this project, and extending its life and reach through technological intervention. The history you’re talking about - Susan B. Anthony and Frederick Douglass - may not be known or easily accessible. What you’re working on may help cultivate a sense of community pride.
Kunsman: Hopefully, and that's where it really helped to break down barriers. So many of our young kids are only watching what they see on the news, and forgetting about some of that history. I'll never forget. It was last year when I asked my Photo One students about Kodak, and they looked at me like "What's Kodak?"
I'm like, "Oh my God, you guys are in photo school." I was astonished! They'd grown up on digital, they'd grown up on iPhones, Nikon, Canon, Sony, and so never worked with film. That’s when I felt really old. Kodak built this town. Kodak and Xerox and Bausch & Lomb, our big employers, and losing them was a major mistake.
Payphone Location Density- Monroe County, NY
Seikaly: You're three and a half or four years into this project. When you look at these photographs, now installed at CEPA Gallery, what comes to mind?
Kunsman: At almost every payphone, I had some interaction with somebody there. Working with a Hasselblad attracts people, whether it's somebody working on the corner or somebody working literally in the parking lot. All classes, all races. They see I'm working with this camera and they come up and ask, "What are you doing?" Next thing they'll be photographing me. I think of those interactions often. I’ve struggled with the edit, because there are so many stories and interactions to share.
There's certain images that are stronger for the attached story, not for their aesthetic appeal. I'm looking at this exhibition at CEPA, including the payphones and the maps that are being installed, and know that this is my halfway point. This is where I wanna see what works, what doesn't work, and try to learn how to improve on it from there. I’m thinking about collaborations.
I'm working now with a Criminal Justice professor, the Digital Humanities and Social Science librarians at RIT to make the maps, this is their specialty.
585.872.9919 – Coach’s Sports Bar, 19 West Main Street, Webster, NY 14580 © Eric Kunsman
Seikaly: I look at the photographs and think about human communication facilitated by a telephone, but there are no human actors in your compositions. That absence is palpable and lends sadness to the scenes. Did you start off thinking this is an environmental portrait?
Kunsman: Absolutely. I recently had a review where a person absolutely hated my work and thought all I was doing was exploiting the poor. And I think the reason for that is because black and white images level the playing field. That reviewer didn't realize some of the images that they were looking at were the richest and poorest suburbs combined. That's another reason for not putting individuals in the photos; it instantly signals race and class.
And that's why if somebody is in it, they tend to be in the background, indiscernible, on purpose. And the reason is it's more or less what I'm getting out of this neighborhood and this area, in the environmental portrait. But at the same time, and that's where again that black and white levels the field. They are Rochester. This is whether you're in the suburbs or you're not. And I think that's that void that you get, that you can't discern whether "What area am I really looking at?" And I think that's one of the biggest things for me.
Even though that was a negative review I received, I used it to shape the exhibition. In the gallery, they're all labeled with the phone number, address, and zip code. I worked with the Digital Humanities librarian and the Criminal Justice professor to produce a booklet that breaks down by zip code rather than city. If you wanna find data about 14611, whether it's housing, income, poverty, drug overdose data, it’s all there.
I’m really trying to make sure there's no labeling applied, that, "Oh, Webster's so much better off than Rochester 'cause look at this." No, let's look at the regions, the zip codes, 'cause even in Webster, there's bad parts, that people would say are bad.
585.586.9201 – Pittsford Place Mall, 3300 Monroe Avenue, Rochester, NY 14618 © Eric Kunsman
Seikaly: "Bad" in quotations.
Kunsman: That's the big part.
Seikaly: When you approached CEPA, did you have an idea for an immersive exhibition in mind for this, for a really immersive interactive exhibition of this work? What you’ve produced really reaches into many more contemporaneous dialogues around race, income disparity, and technology that we're having in this country.
Kunsman: Are you ready for a fun story on this one?
Seikaly: Absolutely. Tell me.
Kunsman: David Mitchell, who was assistant curator at CEPA at the time, came for a studio visit to look at my penitentiary work. I had just started this project, it was four months old. That's how far back this goes with CEPA. And he goes, "What's this?" And I explained, "This is what I'm seeing." It was just a basic thing of what happened when I moved there, and I'm trying it out, these are just fresh. I think I had shot maybe 20 payphones. And he goes, "We don't wanna show your penitentiary work anymore." I'm like, "Why did you drive out here then?" He's like, "I want this." I'm like, "What? I don't even know what this is." He goes, "I want this in two, three years."
And so at the time, I didn’t know what this project was, if it was anything at all. But he saw something, whether it was the fire in my eyes or whatever it was. So initially, none of the interactive elements were discussed. Most of this has come from learning from other individuals. I'm lucky to have a lot of support.
My job is actually with the National Technical Institute for the Deaf at RIT. I support deaf and hard-of-hearing students in the photo lab. And with that, I have a lot of support from them. Showing this work on the portfolio circuit has helped, too. People throw out a little tidbit like, "Oh, this is missing." Or, "What about this?" And I have to credit all the discussions I've had with so many people as to how to expand the project’s reach.
And it's not just my colleagues or portfolio reviews. I've learned stuff from the individuals on the street, just as much as anybody else. And I think my mentor, Louis Draper, who's just now getting recognized with Kamoinge, always said, he'd preach not being the ones that hit and run. You need to interact with the people to truly understand and tell their story. That’s one of the biggest messages. Also, honor them as a human being. And I guess that's something that I applied to this, and that's where all these different facets have really come from.
Poverty Census Data 2019 for Monroe County, NY
Seikaly: I'm imagining that the networks you’re now a part of helps shape who you are, in addition to being a photographer. I think that’s something unique to this particular discipline within photo, long form projects I mean. Yes, you're the person firing the camera shutter, but there are so many other people working with you to make this happen. It's a really beautiful thing.
Kunsman: It's actually helped me get out of my shell a little bit too, not to be so timid and things. Even social media now… It's silly to say, but there's a whole genre of payphone-ography, as it's called. And now some people are exploring obsolete technology and sharing online, like Ryan Steven Green, who maintains the Instagram account @payphonesoflosangeles. We're collaborating now. When I have a show at HOTE Gallery in LA, I'm hoping that we can just do this community event, which could include mapping. I'd rather have that discussion than even show my photographs at this point. We both have become friends with Pentabo Clortino, who maintains the account @screwyblooms.
If you don't know his work, you need to start following him. His entire mission is, if somebody's having a bad day, they're walking down the street, and they see weird, beautiful shit coming out of payphones: flowers, pipes, even the insulation's coming out, sometimes like, "Do Not Open," you open it and it's a flower bouquet, like a fake flower in there. If I can just make you stop thinking about whatever it was for two seconds. If I make you smile, I've gone beyond that.
585.235.9583 – 167 Whitney Street, Rochester, NY, 14611 © Eric Kunsman
585.266.9669, 585.266.9628, 585.266.9629 – 892 North Clinton Avenue, Rochester, NY 14621 © Eric Kunsman
Seikaly: Do you think that this project will influence any other future projects, as far as community engagement and who you work with are concerned?
Kunsman: I think it will, more because I've gained some different tools I can use. I've also been working on a side project, one that started before the payphone project, about the economy of upstate New York. I was already aware of how people judge certain areas, and how upper and western New York are known as the worst places in the United States to have a business.
Seikaly: Tell me more about that.
Kunsman: I have a business that was almost destroyed by the State of New York’s punitive fines. That's where that comes from. What I've learned as a person from this project, going forward, how can I not be engaged? Otherwise, it's like, "I came, I did this and this is all I wanted to do." I truly care about what I've learned, and it's shaped my kids. It's actually affected my family.
I love when people now say, this isn't just a photography project, because it's not. And that's why I'm not knocking photographers who just do photography projects. I think this is part of what Lou had instilled in me many, many years ago: how do you prolong the project and actually have it resonate with people and make them think for more than two seconds when they get out of the gallery?
It has to live on. If not, I'm in trouble.
585.254.9533 – Freebird Cycles, Lyell Avenue, Rochester, NY 14618 © Eric Kunsman
Seikaly: That makes a lot of sense. Alright, last question. When was the last time you used a payphone?
Kunsman: My wife's gonna kill me on this one. Right now at RIT, there's construction going on on the third floor. The payphone booth there is the last one I used, and I remember using it often to call my ex-fiance who lived in New Jersey.
Seikaly: That's hilarious!
Kunsman: It’s hard 'cause all I remember is all the fights that took place in that payphone booth. So, not the greatest memories of payphones, ironically. They're ripping out that payphone booth, which people have been using for a video installation type, the past years, but it's like, good riddance, in some ways.